Surface Pro 3 throttling

The Pro 3 models have a special built "Haswell" series of CPUs.  These are not the ones that you put in a desktop or laptop even though, they would work if they built a motherboard for them.

For the Pro 3 series, these particular CPUs are flatter and wider.  If you want to see a picture of the i5 that is in the current shipped model, go to http://www.ifixit.com.

The "Haswell" series is a whole wide range of CPUs and chances are, you never seen or heard of the others.  These particular CPUs are built just for the Pro 3 models.

The circuitry within them are exactly the same as the regular desktop and laptop "stacked" CPUs that you normally see and those are designed to fit the LGA 1150 "Haswell" socket.  The desktop CPU version was used in the Pro and Pro 2.  So, YES, it is still the 4300U but the chassis of the CPU is redesigned for these tablets.

They did that to flatten them and allow greater cooling for a thinner computer case.

Did you know that they made a Pentium and Celeron versions of the "Haswell" CPUs?

Broadwell will be the next Intel generation coming out.

The surprise/confusion/disappointment that certainly I feel, is that I expected the Pro 3 to perform at least as well as the Pro 2 when it comes to gaming.  Because of the aggressive throttling going on (far more aggressive than that of the Pro 2) it measurably does not perform as well over sustained periods (even as low as over a few minutes).

To use Diablo 3 as an example, I tested it last night on both the Pro 2 and 3.  On the Pro 2 at 1920x1080 with all settings LOW and "Low FX" turned on to improve performance - FPS remained pretty steadily in the high 20s or even 30, even when fighting lots of monsters.  Not stellar by any means - nobody expects the Surface to be a Razer Blade - but it is playable.

On the Pro 3, with the resolution lowered to 1920x1080, and game performance settings the same as the Pro 2, performance starts out the same, but after maybe 5-10 minutes, I'm down to 10-12 FPS.  Borderline unplayable.  I switched back to the desktop for a few minutes, and when I switched back to the game, performance had improved again.  So at least for me the throttling was temporary (as I would think it should be).  It's not a good experience to have to interrupt my gaming every 5 or 10 minutes to give the machine a few minutes to cool down again.

The Pro 3 was on a desk and well ventilated.

It's not awful, but it is a measurable experience downgrade.  I'd return the Pro 3 and wait for the i7 version, if I thought that would improve things, but my fear is that if the i7 model exhibits similar throttling behaviour, then the experience is going to be much the same, and I'll have blown a further $250 for nothing.

I understand everything you are saying about the new chassis, different components etc - that all makes perfect technical sense.  This issue is not going to impact the vast amount of users.  But from a marketing point of view, the Pro 3 has been portrayed as better than what came before.  For most things, it is, but for sustained performance, it is a downgrade.  It's very very disappointing, because this machine is so utterly amazing in every other way.

Microsoft even advertise the Pro 3 for gaming, although there is no mention of which variant they are talking about.....

http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en-us/why-surface/for-gaming

Every part of me wants to keep this wonderful machine, which is why I wish Microsoft would say something about this issue.  "Hey, we're aware of the throttling and the concern it's causing some users.  We're looking into ways to tune the behaviour."  Even if they come back and say "We're sorry but this is the design and we cannot change it without making the risk of physical thermal damage too great" then at least that would be something, and I could make my final decision to keep or return the machine.

Well said, man... feeling the same way

My windows 7 machine is a fine tuned beast, no error/warnings.

So I set out to do the same on the Surface Pro 3, here's the things that have stumped me, and no info on the internet either regarding them.

First things first obviously the wifi issue (has no error logs etc, but it's there lurking...)

We then have the throttle issue, which I have seen traces of in the event logs: Each Boot I get 4 Event 37's

-The speed of processor x in group 0 is being limited by system firmware. The processor performance state for 71 seconds since last report. x = 0 to 3 (each threaded core)

Erm no **** the processor is being limited .

I also have 3 other event 219's each boot.

-The driver /Driver/WudfRd failed to load for the device HID\VID_045EPID_07CCol5\63a0ae90c00004. I traced this to a Wacom technology source (erm why is this even on the computer?)

-The driver \Driver\WudfRd failed to load for the device HID\MSHW0030Col01\5294f3b1910000. I traced this one to one of the two I2C HID Devices

-The driver \Driver\WudfRd failed to load for the device ACPI\MSHW0027\2dana3ff2. I traced this back to "Surface Cover Telemetry" All three are up to date driver wise.

The final warning I get only occurs when the Surface boots with the cover installed,

-Win32k event id 264 -A multi-touch device reported inconsistent contact information.

Again all drivers are up to date and firmware is confirmed to the latest for all components with firmware updates available. I'd like these issues cleaned up or being marked as safe before I start deploying these around the business...

The CPU in the Pro 3 models are different than the models used in the Pro 2.  Even though they are "Haswell" chips, they are built completely different and are not the same type that can be installed in a desktop or laptop (which the Pro and Pro 2 did use).  They are flatter in design and wider to actually increase cooling capability (at least, designed to do so) and that may not be the case.

The temperature sensor settings are most likely different as well (as you may have noticed) and in fact, the Surface Pro 3 tablets are first time the i3, i5, and i7 processors are being used in.  So, that means there is no track record of actual performance.

The only real difference between the SP2 (4200U) and SP3 (4300U) is clock speed.  The processor size is the same between the two.

The throttling max temp can be adjusted usually in BIOS.  The problem with the SP3 is not that it throttles but that it throttles even when it does not need to.  The anandtech review (http://www.anandtech.com/show/8077/microsoft-surface-pro-3-review/3) shows the CPU throttling around 90C and staying throttled down to around 60C.  This is where the problem lies.  MS should be able to bring the lower number up to around 80C - 85C with firmware updates but they may not if we don't let them know we want it.

There may be larger cooling issues preventing this but a sustained temp of around 60C is crippling.