Trouble Making Image Backup with Acronia True Image 2016 -- apparent misread of space

Anonymous
2020-06-18T23:54:58+00:00

I have been trying for days now to make a backup image of my internal Windows 10 hard drive, fully updated to current Windows 10 level May 2020. I have been using Acronis True Image 2016, as I always do. I have been backing up to an external, USB2 connected hard drive with 160 GB of free space on it (a 320 GB hard drive), the same drive I normally backup to. This is a Gateway laptop, NE56R from 2012, which shipped with Windows 8.

I have been trying to backup all partitions, including the C, and recovery partitions (including the Push Button one, which is about 15 GB) and whatever others are there. In total, they are about 109 GB. So I ought to have plenty enough free space.

I have checked all partitions to back up with True Image. It runs the whole backup, takes a good five hours. At the end, it throws up amessage saying ther eis not enough space for the image.

I have never had this problem before. The machine is booted from the True Image disk, so that should rule out some issue wiht my Widows 10 OS. I am doing a full disk backup, and I am even using Maximum Compression, which is what I always use, so I should need something lessthatn 109 GB of free space. and Ihave 160 GB of free space on the external drive.

I have a backup of Win 10 I made in April, shortly before the new OS level cam out on the drive -- I always keep two, just because. I deleted the older of the two on there, so now have only the one. I certainly don't want to delete the one on there, and still have this problem but no backup at all. But Ihave more free space than shudbe needed.

The external drive has been used only for backups since I started using it brand new, and I make a backup once or twice a year -- and I have been using it no more than four years. So, the external drive has very little, hardly any actual use on it, it is not far from brand new.

I read something this morning about a real problem found in the new Win 10 update, something to do with Storage Space, that is some sort of function in the OS now. I don't know what that is, or what it does. But the story said if your drive is not showing as RAW, then it should be OK, not affected. I checked Disk Management, and none of my volumes nor the external drive are marked as RAW. So, that should mean that issue is not the case here.

I have done enough backups in the past four years using the Acronis True Image 2016 software. It has always worked fine, and actually with less free space (I had another item on the drive too, but have deleted it. I also have deleterd about 32 GB of stuff from my C drive in an attempt to make this backup fit, but to no avail -- that is, my last two backups were actually larger than this one, and they fit fine.)

So, why do I keep getting the message about not enough space? I should have way more than enough.

Windows for home | Windows 10 | Windows update

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  1. Anonymous
    2020-07-30T02:44:39+00:00
    1. Yes, it says that. The issue of the R still on the partition makes me think a double check another way might be worthwhile. Can it even work with a letter on that partition?

    EDIT: Ignore anything I said belwo about need to get the R off of part 5 -- as you can see in my next msg, I got it done, and that partition no longer shows in This Computer! END EDIT

    BTW, I again test shift + restart, did not boot to Recovery. I can only go there via Settings after booting up. But I’ll do that and - well, how do I make Command Prompt show it?

    In Acronis, the partition does not have to have a letter on it to back up. Part 6 never has had a letter. I expected the same for part 5 now. Part 6 never showed in This Computer either, but part 5 is now.

    I would always use my own system images, not the Recovery image. I’m keeping that only for the Gateway stuff. I was looking at finding something at Gateway, but that is not likely.Gateway no longer exists, it has been taken over by Acer. Acer isn’t interested in keeping older Gateway stuff around. I’ll look some more after we’re done with this stuff.

    Yes, you’re looking at Disk Management, Yes, all the partitions are there. They were never visible on This Computer page, that’s the point — its not supposed to be. It is now being handled differently. And notice, the old p. 7 image does not have the R on part 5, but the new one does. I think that is why it is visible in This Computer. It also is why Acronis will allow me to deal with files on it, but not the ones without a letter. Part 5 is not supposed to have that letter. We did the command to take it off, but its still on.

    I’ll reboot a few more time, but I already did at least 3-4 times. So, you had that issue too, but after a few reboots it went away. OK, will keep an eye. But if it doesn’t go away, we need to get rid of it. Its not supposed to be accessible in This Computer. (You merely see it listed in Disk Management, its fully accessible in This Computer. Yes, the files in it are invisible.)

    I’ll keep you posted.

    1. Well, since I didn’t check Acronis on it before, I can’t be certain., But I do think it is because it has a letter, that’s all that is showing in the Acronis Files backup. It means it will deal with those files, but it won’t with files on the other partitions, such as the recovery image on part 6, that can’t be backed up via a files backup — unless we were to put a letter on it, I expect.
    2. I’m not talking of having more than one image of the Win 8 image. But we will have zero of it if we don’t copy it before deleting part 6 and then recreating it. We are merely moving it and moving it back.  Again, yes, I know I will use my Win 10 image for any restoring.

    Oh, you keep giving me pieces of the code. I need to put an X on part 6 before I can run that. And then take it off again. I can find the code to do that, I guess I exit first one, then run this line.

    1. not sure what that one is talklng about. I think that is Acronis, and I could see the files in part 5 when in Files backup. Oh, you’re saying what I saw looked to be correct? OK, that’s why I was telling that.

    The recycle bin seems to have come from creating a new partition yesterday, not from moving the file today. The Recycle bin has yesterday’s date on it.

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  2. Anonymous
    2020-07-30T01:06:28+00:00

    That all looks great to me -- good going! Recovery Tools looks fine in Disk Management.

    (1) Your 2nd /Info is telltale...

    C:\WINDOWS\system32>ReagentC  /Info

    Windows Recovery Environment (Windows RE) and system reset configuration

    Information:

        Windows RE status:         Enabled

        Windows RE location:       \?\GLOBALROOT\device\harddisk0*partition5*\Recovery\WindowsRE

        Boot Configuration Data (BCD) identifier: 06a7379d-d1bb-11ea-8997-b888e3b1b2f5

        Recovery image location:  \?\GLOBALROOT\device\harddisk0*partition6*\RecoveryImage

        Recovery image index:      2

        Custom image location:

        Custom image index:        0

    REAGENTC.EXE: Operation Successful.

    (a) It says Partition 5 is now the "Windows RE location". That is, it holds the WinRE.wim that will become the recovery environment (Choose an Option) when you Shift+Restart (or whatever). And we know that is a 2004 environment. Go there, & "Troubleshoot > Advanced Options > Command Prompt" will show the same 2004 version you saw before: 10.0.19041.0.

    Now, when the computer undergoes its next upgrade/repair install, the new WinRE.wim will overwrite (replace) this one in Partition 5. Also, Windows system image backup & restore will automatically select Partition 5 to backup as a mandatory, & Partition 6 will only be an optional (provided you put a letter on it). It used to look like this...

    Now you'll see Recovery Tools instead of Push Button Reset as the mandatory one.

    (b) Yet Partition 6 remains the recovery image location. If ever the button is found & pushed (or you try a Reset, I guess), the Install.wim that is in there will be restored. It will be Win 8 with a ton of Gateway add-ons. That's what you wanted -- but I still think, really, Partition 6 should be dispensed with, & you should use your own system images instead which have all the changes you've made since 2012. There just can't be any good reason to ever return to Win 8 once you've got a working Win 10. In the worst possible situation (i.e., no image will restore), you would clean install Win 10. Any Gateway app that wipes out is likely recoverable at the Gateway site.

    In any event, you need never make another image of Partition 6. It never will change from its 2012 date now that Partition 5 gets the new WinRE.wim files again. I don't know what happened in 2017 that made Windows switch to Partition 6.

    (2)  Both XCOPY commands did what they should going by the DIR commands you showed. The second one overwrote a few files that had not been deleted by ReagentC /Disable, but mainly it replaced the WinRE.wim that had been removed. That's what you wanted.

    (3) "But note, in This Computer, see image below, it now lists part 5, the Recovery Tools part. None of those partitions have ever been listed before."

    Here is your Disk Management from page 7...

    Partition 5 was listed, all right, but it showed differently because it had no letter or label. In that case, it shows the disk & partition number instead: Disk 0 partition 5.

    (4) "AND it still has R assigned to the partition"

    Well, I thought I was going batty when that happened to me. But my letter eventually did go. Try again & reboot. Or maybe it takes a reboot to the recovery environment (Choose an Option). Then, remove it at "Troubleshoot > Advanced Options > Command Prompt"...

    DiskPart                    <<< Enter DiskPart

    List  Vol                     <<< Shows the letters

    Select  Vol  x             <<< "x" is the volume that has the letter R

    Remove  Letter=R     <<< Remove the letter R

    List  Vol                      <<< Show it's gone

    Exit                            <<< Exit DiskPart

    Exit                            <<< Exit the Command Prompt (or use its "X")

    Click "Continue" to get back to Windows.

    The letter has no ill effect except it makes the partition show up in File Explorer. Still, File Explorer won't show its contents, unless you play with Folder Options (type into Search)...

    You have to uncheck "Hide protected...". But even then there will be a major battle with permissions before you can open a folder or file. But supposedly this makes the partition susceptible to hacking. So we do want the letter removed.

    (5) "Re Acronis, does see Part 5 as the R partition. But in Full disk backup, it makes no difference, that shows all the partitions."

    Yep, but you should backup Partition 6 just once ever, if even that many times. It never will change now.

    (6) "The R does make a difference for file backup. In that, none of the partitions we have been working on show, except part 5 - because it is labeled as the R partition"

    Partition 5 mainly is treated differently by Windows & 3rd-party apps because it is the active Recovery partition now. Where you saw extra attention paid to Partition 6, that attention now goes to 5 now. The letter & label do make a difference too, as you saw in Disk Management & File Explorer.

    (7) "Even in the theory that we could assign a letter to part 6 and then back that up, I do not think this is very easy, I'm sure things will get lost. This is not set up for very easy individual file backup."

    I had a tough time detaching from my own Dell Win 8.1 factory reinstall partition too. I held onto it well into the various Win 10 versions. But mine wasn't intruding into Win 10 system images like yours was. There's no reason you should have more than one image of it, if even that many. Your own Win 10 system images have everything you need.

    But -- if you must have it -- show what I requested yesterday: "DIR  X:\  /a  /s" & "BCDEdit  /Enum  All".

    (8) "But that allowed me to see files on part 5."

    That sounds normal to me. Here is mine today...

    C:\WINDOWS\system32>DIR R:\ /a /s

     Volume in drive R is WinRE 2004

     Volume Serial Number is 9AB3-01BA

     Directory of R:\

    07/27/2020  01:03 AM    <DIR>          $RECYCLE.BIN

    07/27/2020  12:35 AM    <DIR>          Recovery

    07/28/2020  03:28 AM    <DIR>          System Volume Information

                   0 File(s)              0 bytes

     Directory of R:$RECYCLE.BIN

    07/27/2020  01:03 AM    <DIR>          .

    07/27/2020  01:03 AM    <DIR>          ..

    07/27/2020  01:03 AM    <DIR>          S-1-5-21-191566122-1535656984-3147892972-1001

                   0 File(s)              0 bytes

     Directory of R:$RECYCLE.BIN\S-1-5-21-191566122-1535656984-3147892972-1001

    07/27/2020  01:03 AM    <DIR>          .

    07/27/2020  01:03 AM    <DIR>          ..

    07/27/2020  01:03 AM               129 desktop.ini

                   1 File(s)            129 bytes

     Directory of R:\Recovery

    07/27/2020  12:35 AM    <DIR>          .

    07/27/2020  12:35 AM    <DIR>          ..

    07/27/2020  09:34 PM    <DIR>          Logs

    07/28/2020  01:30 AM    <DIR>          WindowsRE

                   0 File(s)              0 bytes

     Directory of R:\Recovery\Logs

    07/27/2020  09:34 PM    <DIR>          .

    07/27/2020  09:34 PM    <DIR>          ..

    07/28/2020  01:30 AM             1,384 Reload.xml

                   1 File(s)          1,384 bytes

     Directory of R:\Recovery\WindowsRE

    07/28/2020  01:30 AM    <DIR>          .

    07/28/2020  01:30 AM    <DIR>          ..

    12/07/2019  05:08 AM         3,170,304 boot.sdi

    07/28/2020  01:30 AM             1,139 ReAgent.xml

    07/09/2020  11:23 PM       525,321,603 Winre.wim

                   3 File(s)    528,493,046 bytes

         Total Files Listed:

                   5 File(s)    528,494,559 bytes

                  16 Dir(s)     341,311,488 bytes free

    It's got its Recycle Bin back with just a Desktop.ini inside a GUID folder. And it looks even worse in the recovery environment (Choose an Option)'s Command Prompt showing the other stuff you mentioned. It's normal let's presume. The main thing is that Shift+Restart (or whatever) gets there & it works. And I thoroughly tested it.

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  3. Anonymous
    2020-07-29T18:04:03+00:00

    OK, final report for now, updating from Acronis at bottom.

    First, I think at the moment, we should focus on getting that R off part 5. Unfortunately, I don't recall definitively if I left the R on there yesterday, but I lean to think I had. Maybe I simply need to run that code to take it off one more time? No, even if I left it on, DiscPart this morning  rejected putting another on and later said it took the R off.

    Second, how do we confirm that part 5 now is the active recovery partition? We should do something to confirm. In fact, this issue with the R might even prevent it from being the recovery partition.

    Re Acronis, does see Part 5 as the R partition. But in Full disk backup, it makes no difference, that shows all the partitions.

    The R does make a difference for file backup. In that, none of the partitions we have been working on show, except part 5 - because it is labeled as the R partition.

    Even in the theory that we could assign a letter to part 6 and then back that up, I do not think this is very easy, I'm sure things will get lost. This is not set up for very easy individual file backup. The navigation to find anything is not like it is from the desktop, I looked all over everything before I finally blundered into my files -- but even then, doesn't seem to be all my files on the desktop. The navigation is crazy, it will only lead to issues. This is better for all files from a disk or volume.

    But that allowed me to see files on part 5. It does have the Recovery folder and with the wim along with other files inside. It also has a Recycle bin, dated from yesterday. And System Volume Info. Recycle bin includes a desktop.ini dated yesterday. System volume folder includes an EDP folder and a Recovery folder. In the Recovery folder it says 0, as in nothing in it. But the other Recovery folder with files in it is the third item n Part 5.

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  4. Anonymous
    2020-07-29T17:15:54+00:00

    Here is the pic of Disk Manager view now -- with the amount of content in part 6, it certainly still has the recovery OS, probably the Recovery folder too.

    But note, in This Computer, see image below, it now lists part 5, the Recovery Tools part. None of those partitions have ever been listed before. AND it still has R assigned to the partition, that is probably why it is showing. You see the code above indicating it took that letter off -- but it did not. How can we get that letter off?

    Also, when I open it, it indicates there is nothing in it! Is the file we just moved not in it?!

    I'm a bit alarmed now. But I'll bet you can help get this straightened out.

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  5. Anonymous
    2020-07-29T16:54:58+00:00

    And here is the readout from making part 5 the active recovery partition. Notice, uh oh, when I went to put R on part 5, it was rejected again, even though you can see in the above code that I did take it off then, and it said it was off. Now I worry,  but will proceed -- since if we try to do something to R and it can't find R, it will indicate that. Now I see when taking the letter off, it said it did so fine -- can't do that if it was not on it. What's going on?

    Also, at the line about overwriting part X, you did not say how to answer the question it asks. I answered Yes, "overwrite X. I hope it did not overwrite the entire contents.

    And I will now reboot. Then check things with Acronis, although there should be no difference with that.

    Microsoft Windows [Version 10.0.19041.388]

    (c) 2020 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

    C:\WINDOWS\system32>DiskPart

    Microsoft DiskPart version 10.0.19041.1

    Copyright (C) Microsoft Corporation.

    On computer: COMPUTER

    DISKPART> Select  Disk  0

    Disk 0 is now the selected disk.

    DISKPART> Select  Part  5

    Partition 5 is now the selected partition.

    DISKPART> Assign  Letter=R

    Virtual Disk Service error:

    The specified drive letter is not free to be assigned.

    DISKPART> Select  Part  6

    Partition 6 is now the selected partition.

    DISKPART> Assign  Letter=X

    DiskPart successfully assigned the drive letter or mount point.

    DISKPART> Exit

    Leaving DiskPart...

    C:\WINDOWS\system32>ReagentC  /Info

    Windows Recovery Environment (Windows RE) and system reset configuration

    Information:

        Windows RE status:         Enabled

        Windows RE location:       \?\GLOBALROOT\device\harddisk0\partition6\Recovery\WindowsRE

        Boot Configuration Data (BCD) identifier: 2d25babf-c701-11ea-bc80-f9e613436a82

        Recovery image location:   \?\GLOBALROOT\device\harddisk0\partition6\RecoveryImage

        Recovery image index:      2

        Custom image location:

        Custom image index:        0

    REAGENTC.EXE: Operation Successful.

    C:\WINDOWS\system32>ReagentC  /Disable

    REAGENTC.EXE: Operation Successful.

    C:\WINDOWS\system32>ReagentC  /SetREImage  /Path  R:\Recovery\WindowsRE  /Target  C:\Windows

    Directory set to: \?\GLOBALROOT\device\harddisk0\partition5\Recovery\WindowsRE

    REAGENTC.EXE: Operation Successful.

    C:\WINDOWS\system32>ReagentC  /Enable

    REAGENTC.EXE: Operation Successful.

    C:\WINDOWS\system32>ReagentC  /Info

    Windows Recovery Environment (Windows RE) and system reset configuration

    Information:

        Windows RE status:         Enabled

        Windows RE location:       \?\GLOBALROOT\device\harddisk0\partition5\Recovery\WindowsRE

        Boot Configuration Data (BCD) identifier: 06a7379d-d1bb-11ea-8997-b888e3b1b2f5

        Recovery image location:   \?\GLOBALROOT\device\harddisk0\partition6\RecoveryImage

        Recovery image index:      2

        Custom image location:

        Custom image index:        0

    REAGENTC.EXE: Operation Successful.

    C:\WINDOWS\system32>XCOPY  R:\Recovery  X:\Recovery  /E  /I  /H  /R  /K  /X

    Overwrite X:\Recovery\Logs\Reload.xml (Yes/No/All)? y

    R:\Recovery\Logs\Reload.xml

    R:\Recovery\WindowsRE\boot.sdi

    R:\Recovery\WindowsRE\ReAgent.xml

    R:\Recovery\WindowsRE\Winre.wim

    4 File(s) copied

    C:\WINDOWS\system32>DIR  X:\Recovery  /a  /s

     Volume in drive X is Push Button Reset

     Volume Serial Number is D49F-5C80

     Directory of X:\Recovery

    07/29/2020  09:48 AM    <DIR>          .

    07/29/2020  09:48 AM    <DIR>          ..

    07/29/2020  09:25 AM    <DIR>          Logs

    07/29/2020  09:48 AM    <DIR>          WindowsRE

                   0 File(s)              0 bytes

     Directory of X:\Recovery\Logs

    07/29/2020  09:25 AM    <DIR>          .

    07/29/2020  09:25 AM    <DIR>          ..

    07/19/2020  12:37 PM             1,379 Reload.xml

                   1 File(s)          1,379 bytes

     Directory of X:\Recovery\WindowsRE

    07/29/2020  09:48 AM    <DIR>          .

    07/29/2020  09:48 AM    <DIR>          ..

    12/07/2019  02:08 AM         3,170,304 boot.sdi

    07/29/2020  09:46 AM             1,164 ReAgent.xml

    07/15/2020  05:33 PM       555,507,721 Winre.wim

                   3 File(s)    558,679,189 bytes

         Total Files Listed:

                   4 File(s)    558,680,568 bytes

                   8 Dir(s)   3,137,146,880 bytes free

    C:\WINDOWS\system32>DiskPart

    Microsoft DiskPart version 10.0.19041.1

    Copyright (C) Microsoft Corporation.

    On computer: COMPUTER

    DISKPART> Select  Disk  0

    Disk 0 is now the selected disk.

    DISKPART> Select  Part  5

    Partition 5 is now the selected partition.

    DISKPART> Remove  Letter=R

    DiskPart successfully removed the drive letter or mount point.

    DISKPART>

    DISKPART> Select  Part  6

    Partition 6 is now the selected partition.

    DISKPART> Remove  Letter=X

    DiskPart successfully removed the drive letter or mount point.

    DISKPART> Exit

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